Premier League latest: Man City v Man Utd & Cardiff v Spurs

City thrash rivals United in the Manchester derby as Tottenham grab a late win at Cardiff to go second.

25 September 2013 Last updated at 15:13 GMT

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As it happened

  1. 1903: 

    I'll leave you with this doozie of a stat from Liverpool's in-house statistician Ged Rea.

    "During the whole of the 2012-13 PL season the lead changed hands only 4 times. So far after 5 games it has changed hands 7 times, " he tweets.

    It's been full of thrill and spills and we are only a month in.

    Bye for now.

  2. 1900: 

    We are heading off into the sunset.

    But not before reminding you that all today's drama will be packaged up and beamed straight into your eyeballs on Match of the Day 2 on BBC One and online from 2225 BST today.

    We'll be back with live text commentary on all the Capital One Cup action from Tuesday on. Plenty of big games in there including Aston Villa v Tottenham, Fulham v Everton, West Brom v Arsenal and Newcastle v Leeds.

    And a certain Luis Suarez is back and hoping to cause Manchester United more misery. As tasty as a Chelsea defender's arm.

  3. 1853: 
    PLAYER REACTION- Man City 4-1 Man Utd
    Samir Nasri

    Manchester City midfielder Samir Nasri: "It's really special to win because we send a big statement to our rivals that Manchester City is going to be a force. To win a derby, our fans today and tomorrow will be happy. It's a special moment to win it like this.

    "For us it's a different feeling from last season. Today is a little bit of revenge. Last season everyone was sad because Robin (van Persie) scored a late free-kick. This time it's different. We showed today in our team we have big players and produced a big performance."

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    Steve Elton: Poor performance but tough start out the way, now to kick on! Van Persie back, with Nani & Januzaj involved, better times ahead!

    Mike Yost: I was at the game. Utd were awful, City deserved Utd players showed any passion for the derby.

    Sadozaie: City all the way for title but the challenge will come from north London this time not not from within Manchester.

  5. 1850: 
    PLAYER REACTION- Cardiff 0-1 Tottenham
    Michael Dawson

    Tottenham defender Michael Dawson: "There's no better feeling than a late goal. We had plenty of chances to kill them off earlier but they dug deep and their keeper made some great saves.

    "It's a win and a clean sheet - but I always say it starts from the front. We created chances so it's looking positive.

    "It's still early but we've put ourselves in a great position.

    "It normally takes time for new signings to settle, but the way we've got four wins out of five, you can't argue with that."

  6. 1846: 

    Reaction to City's 4-1 win over United has been setting the social media world buzzing, including the BBC Sport Facebook page.

    Gary Woolton - Before the season started Wenger was lambasted because he didn't buy anyone, the fact he already had a team is besides the point, Pellegrini after the game at Cardiff was not up to the job, Jose shouldn't have come back, and so on and so on... it is five games... there is a lot more that will happen in the other 33 before this is settled.

    Jon Gates - United have had some tough games so far. I know champions are expected to beat all in front of them, but look at results so far, no team has been outright amazing.

    Mark Gowans - I know it's really too early in the season but I've said from the start that Moyes wasn't up to the job and only got it because of Fergie's influence.

  7. 1846: 
    MANAGER REACTION- Cardiff 0-1 Tottenham
    Malky Mackay

    Cardiff City manager Malky Mackay: "The boys put in a magnificent effort against a very good team. The amount of chances we had, the disallowed goal. Hugo Lloris is a very lucky man tonight.

    "It's about being more clinical but we matched a very good team toe to toe again.

    "We put them under pressure and I'm very proud of my players. They're a great group to work with and I'm glad I'm in the trenches with them this season.

    "They're relishing the size of the task this season and are giving as good as they get. They're loving the fact that we're in the Premier League and we're actually competing."

  8. 1844: 
    Cardiff 0-1 Tottenham

    Cardiff boss Malky Mackay has given a pretty measured assessment of his team's performance today. There was plenty of spirit and a fair bit of quality in their showing.

  9. 1838: 
    PLAYER REACTION- Man City 4-1 Man Utd
    Nemanja Vidic

    Manchester United captain Nemanja Vidic speaking to Sky Sports: "From the first minute City tried to be aggressive and had more possession in the first 20 or 30 minutes. We didn't really get in the game from the first minute.

    "This is what we have try to learn from. We can't look back. It's horrible to lose the derby. It's always horrible. It's worse when you lose in this way. 4-0 down.

    "We were never close to winning the game. That's disappointing. We have to come back but from tomorrow we start to be positive and move on."

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    Solomon Jeffin: Kagawa and Hernandez would have helped in moving the game forward than backward but it can't mask us being outplayed.

    Joshua Silver: United have made 2 effective signings in last 2 summer transfer windows, RVP and Fellaini, City have made 5+, a big difference.

    Luke Wilson: Everton under Moyes were slow starters but they were always flying towards the end of the season.

  11. 1834: 
    Man City 4-1 Man Utd
    Vincent Kompany

    Vincent Kompany on Twitter: "RT if you feel the same.. Yeeeeeeeeeeeeessss!! #City #City #City #City !! :-) :-)"


    Craig Malpass, via mobile on 81111: "Moyes was always going to have a result like this early on in his tenure. It was a dreadful start to the second half but United didn't cave to what could've been a much heavier loss. The reaction to this result is where Moyes will earn his stripes and I have every faith he'll deliver."

  13. 1834: 

    Manchester United manager David Moyes in the post-match press conference: "If ever there was a group of players I would expect [a reaction from after a defeat] that is Manchester United players. They react and that is what they will do. Every manager has bad days and bad results. I am no different."

    "I have been here [at the Etihad] with Everton many times and I don't think I suffered a defeat like this with Everton. I talked with the players the same as I would at any other clubs. They are good pros here and they know when they are bang at it and when they are not."

  14. 1833: 

    David Moyes has also told the post-match press conference that he "made the players aware of his expectations". I think that might translate to something a little more x-rated behind the dressing room door.

    Moyes' repeated suggestion that the fixture list was somehow engineered to give United a tough start is also a difficult one to understand. It seems far-fetched, pointless now the season has started and an open invite for the Football Association to investigate whether he has brought the game into disrepute.

  15. 1828: 
    David Moyes

    Manchester United David Moyes: "We didn't play well enough to win the game. Manchester City played well and deserved the victory.

    "If you lose four you are not expecting to win too many. We conceded poor goals. We needed to get closer in the second half but they get away and score more goals.

    "We never got a grip of the game and we could never really stop them. We hoped to stem that tide in the second half. We got better as the game went on but it was too late.

    "I thought Wayne Rooney's performance was outstanding. He didn't deserve to be on the losing side today. He was first class.

    "The start to the season could be a lot better. We did say it could be difficult start. I wasn't convinced when the balls came out of the Premier League bag and I'm still not convinced."

  16. 1826: 

    Can David Moyes still lead his team to the title despite losing 4-1 to Manchester City? Who will win the Premier League this year? Go to the BBC Sport Facebook page to have your say on the 2013-14 season or share your thoughts using #bbcfootball.

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    Peter Truman: All the attention on the Manchester derby but two north London clubs top of table, Spurs with best defence in league.

    Hammam Ayoub: Hardest first five games are done and dusted. It's not a major disaster for United although they need a midfielder.

    Matt Chapman: City nowhere near as good as people are making out. Horror defensive display from United and no attacking threat bar Rooney.

  18. 1823: 
    MANAGER REACTION- Cardiff 0-1 Tottenham
    Andre Villas Boas

    Tottenham manager Andre Villas-Boas: "Today it was different from normal in that there was justice in football. We created so many chances that there could only be one winner.

    "Last season we had the best record away from home after Man United. We looked very strong.

    "Bearing in mind the win they got against Man City there won't be many teams getting points here so I'm happy.

    "[Cardiff's] David Marshall is a great goalkeeper. He did extremely well today.

    "It's a great win. But I suffered a lot…like everyone else!"

  19. 1820: 
    Cardiff 0-1 Tottenham

    Meanwhile, a considerably more upbeat Andre Villas-Boas has been grinning like a Cheshire cat as he chats to reporters in the bowels of the Cardiff City stadium.

  20. 1818: 
    Man City 4-1 Man Utd

    Manchester United boss David Moyes has just appeared in front of the television cameras. "We didn't play well enough," he starts with considerable understatement.

  21. 1816: 
    GET INVOLVED- #bbcfootball

    Abdul Kadir Bello: Dear Birmingham City, can we exchange Young for Lingard? It was a clerical error from the HR department. Thanks.

    Jesse Lingard, on loan from Man United, scored all four goals in Birmingham City's 4-1 win over Sheffield Wednesday on Saturday.

  22. 1816: 
    MANAGER REACTION- Man City 4-1 Man Utd
    Manuel Pellegrini

    Manchester City manager Manuel Pellegrini:

    "It was a great win against Manchester United and no-one believes that 4-1 is possible before the game. We try to be the team that has possession of the ball and creates chances.

    "It's important to score the second goal before we finished the first half. But I think that is the way we are playing. We had a lot of chances and possession of the ball.

    "It's an important game for the team. And for the fans they will be happy for the month now.

    "Winning a derby is a big match and we must continue improving. Every day we are improving.

    "I think we have a squad with two important players in each position because we have a lot of matches. We think with less numbers of players in the squad it's difficult to arrive in March without problems."

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    Fahim: Why do people forget that Utd have played Chelsea, Liverpool and City in their first 5 games. Now we can go on a winning run!

    Sophie Gayter: Let's put that down to a bad day at the office. Very tough first 5 games for Utd, hopefully will only get stronger

    Andy Boyd: As a United fan it shames me to admit that finishing in the top four would be a massive achievement this year.

  24. 1809: 

    While his old side have come good at the end, Gareth Bale has failed to make it to even the first minute of Real Madrid's meeting with Getafe.

    The Welsh world-record breaker has has to withdraw from what should have been his home debut after picking up an injury in the warm-up.

    Our dedicated live text commentary is the best place to keep up to date with how Cristiano Ronaldo, Isco, Karim Benzema and the rest get on without him.

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    Dave Llondel: As an Arsenal supporter, someone just licked the icing off the cake after the Manchester result.

    Amir Eloush: Fergie's next job will be to talk Scholes out of his umpteenth retirement. Utd's midfield are crying out for someone like him.

    Marcus Neale: City have been exceptional. Utd have been poor. Moyes still finding his feet and needs a strong reaction.

  26. 1804: 
    Man City 4-1 Man Utd

    Manchester United fans might like to know that the history books suggest that all is not lost by any means.

    Six of Manchester United's 13 Premier League titles have come after they won only two of their opening five games.

  27. 1802: 
    Man United dejected

    Tom, Drayton, via mobile on 81111: "Man City have been sublime today, United have had nothing on them, Rooney is the only United player to show up today."

    Vincent Kompany

    Manchester City captain Vincent Kompany: "Maybe the game meant a little bit more to us than for them. We were looking forward to this fixture. We need to win these kind of games. There was no reason why we should fear the opposition.

    "We played with two strikers, two very good strikers, and defensively we've had a good record for the past three years. It was mainly because we stayed so calm today.

    "It's too early to say it's a defining game. You make a statement over the course of the season. But it would be silly to give away three precious points.

    "When we won 6-1 at Old Trafford I said we need to stay humble. It's only three points, but it's a good game to win and it gives the fans something to celebrate over the next few days."

  29. 1800: 
    FULL-TIME STATS ROUND-UP- Man City 4-1 Man Utd
    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 4-1 Man United

    "My league prediction at the start of the season was City first, Chelsea second and United third. And I'm sticking with City because of the size and quality of their squad."

  31. 1757: 
    FULL-TIME- Cardiff 0-1 Tottenham

    A relieved Tottenham are home and dry. They go second in the table, behind Arsenal on goal difference.

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    Dilli: Just gotta admit when you're not good enough. Outplayed completely. Hope this starts some serious long term rebuilding.

    Paul Clarkson: United need to strengthen a lot in January. Coentrao or Baines ? Need a Schweinsteiger/Iniesta to command central midfield.

    Chris Riley: Crisis at Stamford Bridge? United sit in 8th and already 5 points off top.

  33. 1753: 
    GOAL- Cardiff 0-1 Tottenham - Paulinho (90+3 mins)

    Jubilation among the travelling fans. They have been made to wait, but the goal when it comes is a good-looking one as well. Lewis Holtby slips in Erik Lamela down the side and the Argentine's low cross is flicked into the net by Paulinho. Brilliant improvisation. That was Spurs' 24 attempt at goal.


    Ron McCullough, via mobile on 81111: "As a Liverpool fan it doesn't get much better than this. Ample compensation for Saturday."

  35. 1752: 
    FULL-TIME- Man City 4-1 Man Utd

    A half that was dead as a contest after just five minutes comes to an end. United's players look disconsolate.

  36. 1751: 
    FOUR MINUTES OF INJURY TIME- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Tottenham are laying siege to the Cardiff goal, but the hosts are holding out. Lewis Holtby has been brought on for Spurs and Kyle Walker rattles a low shot just wide as four minutes of injury-time comes up on the board.


    Henry, Oxford, via mobile on 81111: "Dare I say that this Tottenham game is the kind that used to be salvaged by a certain Welshman producing a screamer late on for the win..."

  38. 1748: 
    FINAL FIVE- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Tottenham are running out of time in south Wales. If it stays the same, they will move up to fourth and no further.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 4-1 Man United

    "What a goal. Wayne Rooney has been magnificent for United today. The other nine outfield players should look at him and think 'you know what, you've been great'."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  40. 1744: 
    GOAL- Man City 4-1 Man Utd - Wayne Rooney (87 mins)

    A pearl of a free-kick from Wayne Rooney, but it does not even get a flicker of a smile from the scorer. Joe Hart was well beaten by a delivery straight into the postage stamp from 25 yards by the United striker. That makes Rooney the all-time leading scorer in Manchester derbies - one ahead of Francis Lee and Joe Hayes - with 10.

  41. 1744: 
    CLOSE!- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    A great chance for Cardiff, who are coming on strong as the time ticks down. The lively Peter Odemwingie tip-toes along the byeline before cutting the ball back to Aron Gunnarsson who blazes over when hitting the target was the minimum required.

  42. 1740: 
    TEN TO GO- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Ten minutes left on the clock for Tottenham to find a winner against Cardiff.


    Barney Cunningham: I honestly think Januzaj should be starting for Manchester United. He is far better than any of our other wingers.

    Clarkey: City showing their true force today, not even a shot on target for United is embarrassing.

    NikNak: Kompany's performance today. Wow.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 4-0 Man United

    "I think David Moyes will give his players a real dressing down and they'll deserve it. In every single department they've been second best."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  45. 1740: 
    HITS THE WOODWORK- Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    Manchester United's Patrice Evra loses his similarly titchy marker Sergio Aguero to meet a corner with a firm near-post header which thuds back off the post. Wayne Rooney drills in a low shot in the ensuing melee but Joe Hart's shins are a strong enough barrier to keep it out.

  46. 1737: 
    CLOSE!- Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    Edin Dzeko's dipping effort from 25 yards should be meat and drink to David de Gea, but the ball spills out of the Spaniard's cradling arms and bobbles towards the goalline. De Gea springs back to recover it just in time.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 4-0 Man United

    "Against Cardiff, Hull and Stoke, Man City looked poor. But the win in the Champions League looks to have given them confidence. They've looked on a different level to United today."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  48. 1735: 
    Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    Marouane Fellaini is looking ragged in the Manchester United midfield. He is bustled off the ball by Pablo Zabaleta before over-hitting a pass to Danny Welbeck a minute later. His whole team have been shown up today though.

  49. 1735: 
    GOAL COMMENTARY- Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    "This is now an embarrassment for United" as Samir Nasri scores the fourth goal for Manchester City.

  50. 1733: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    The industrious Alvaro Negredo will not get a goal for all the energy he has expended. He is off and Edin Dzeko is given a chance to stretch his legs.


    Ciaran, United fan, via mobile on 81111: "I saw Everton keep possession of the ball last year miles better than United have done this season. I think the problem lies with the players not the manager."

  52. 1732: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Tottenham call for more firepower off the bench. Erik Lamela is on in place of Gylfi Sigurdsson. Twenty minutes remain.

  53. 1731: 
    Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Peter Odemwingie comes close to giving Cardiff a lead they do not deserve as he slips inside his marker and curls a shot just wide of Hugo Lloris's far post.

  54. 1729: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    James Milner is on for the impressive Jesus Navas for City.

  55. 1729: 
    YELLOW CARD- Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    Antonio Valencia goes into the book after arguing a little too forcefully with referee Howard Webb about a byeline wrestle with Aleksandar Kolarov.

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    Matt Simpson: At least Liverpool haven't had the worst weekend now.

    Mike Lawrence: Kneejerk reactions all over the shop. Yes, it's 4-0, but it's still only 1 game. Calls for Moyes to be sacked are ridiculous.

    Murray White: You know Man United are struggling when Carrick starts giving the ball away.

  57. 1727: 
    Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    United's Marouane Fellaini brings a good save out of Joe Hart as he tries his luck from the apex of the box. It would have had to be a worldie of a strike to beat Hart from there though.

  58. 1726: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Cardiff are making a change with Fraizer Campbell making way for Peter Odemwingie. The hosts are still under the cosh.

  59. 1725: 
    GOAL COMMENTARY- Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    Listen to the moment Sergio Aguero's second goal "finishes off United" to make it 3-0 early in the second half.

  60. 1724: 
    Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    Danny Welbeck sends a shot streaking well over the top. Wayne Rooney's big chance aside, United have not created any clear openings.

    Man City 4-0 Man United

    BBC Radio 5 live presenter Danny Baker: "In music terms thought Man U post-Sir AF might be like Genesis after Peter Gabriel left. Today they are more like Wham after George Michael."

  62. 1723: 
    Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    United's striker Wayne Rooney slams a free-kick, from a decent position 25 yards out, straight into the wall. When the ball is chipped back into the box, Marouane Fellaini gives away a free-kick for manhandling Pablo Zabaleta and the pressure is released.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 4-0 Man United

    "I think Jesus Navas has been excellent. There's always an end product. But the way he's tracked back and defended. That's what United's wingers should have been doing too."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

    Jesus Navas
  64. 1721: 
    Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    The atmosphere at the Etihad is a little short of jubilant. They were probably braced for a more nerve-racking afternoon. United are now pressing forward, but have found their way to a goal that would surely only be a consolation.

  65. 1719: 
    Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    David Marshall is having a storming game between the sticks for Cardiff, clawing out a Roberto Soldado effort in the latest of a string of outstanding stops. Can Spurs find a way past him? Half an hour to go.

  66. 1718:  
    Phil McNulty, BBC Sport Chief Football Writer at Etihad StadiumMan City 4-0 Man Utd

    "The introduction of Tom Cleverley for Ashley Young - who was utterly hopeless - almost looks like an act of damage limitation from a desperate manager. And these are desperate times for David Moyes as his first Manchester derby turns into abject embarrassment."

    Man City 4-0 Man United

    Opta Joe: 3 - Man City have now scored 4+ goals against United in the PL three times, more than any other club (Newcastle have done it twice). Noisy.

  68. 1717: 
    Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    This afternoon is getting uglier and uglier for United. A low cross snakes through the City box and onto Wayne Rooney's right foot. But with Pablo Zabaleta lunging in front of him, the England striker lifts his shot over the bar from eight yards.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 4-0 Man United

    "You'll get people phoning 606 later saying David Moyes has to go and that's nonsense. But his team have been outplayed today."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

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    Miracle Roch: What are the odds on Ferguson coming out of retirement?

    Mr Partington To You: This is what happens when you panic buy in the transfer market, as opposed to spending smart money early on!

    Grant Payne: United's defence is leakier than my garden pipes in torrential rain... incredible stuff from City - title theirs to lose?

  71. 1715: 
    HITS THE WOODWORK- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Tottenham are within a bar's width of the lead. Gylfi Sigurdsson curls onto the bar with David Marshall beaten, but the Cardiff keeper immediately has work to do as he makes a good stop to deny Roberto Soldado's snap-shot from the rebound.

  72. 1714: 

    The world's most expensive player, Gareth Bale, makes his home debut for Real Madrid in their La Liga match against Getafe at 1800 BST.

    We will have live text commentary of that match shortly.


    Adam, Leicester, via mobile on 81111: "People are getting it wrong, United are not a one-man team, they're a one-manager team..."

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 4-0 Man United

    "They were queuing up to score! Navas has run half the length of the pitch. I don't know where Evra was. You're thinking can City make it more emphatic and score five or six?!"

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  75. 1711: 
    Man City 4-0 Man Utd

    Manchester United are being caught short at the back as they go down fighting with men committed forward. Nemanja Vidic has to be smart to prevent Alvaro Negredo poking in Jesus Navas's cross.

  76. 1708: 
    GOAL- Man City 4-0 Man Utd - Samir Nasri (50 mins)

    This is carnage. Jesus Navas saunters down the right, encountering no defenders on his way to the byeline. A marauding Vincent Kompany and Alvaro Negredo are waiting for his cross, but it is Samir Nasri who is picked out for a simple side-foot finish.

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    Abdul Karim: Time to find out if Moyes has a hair dryer!

    Peter Taylor: What has David Moyes done to this team since July? They're unrecognisable from last season.

    Alessandro Corbino: How was it that easy? My U7s could've walked through that defence...

  78. 1707: 
    KICK-OFF- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Cardiff and Tottenham resume hostilities in south Wales.

  79. 1707:  
    Phil McNulty, BBC Sport Chief Football Writer at Etihad StadiumMan City 3-0 Man Utd

    David Moyes' half-time words wasted within seconds as Manchester City make it 3-0. What a nightmare this is turning into for Manchester United's new manager.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 3-0 Man United

    "Rio Ferdinand didn't even know Sergio Aguero was there. He reacted far too late. Poor, poor defending from United and an easy tap in for Aguero."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  81. 1704: 
    GOAL- Man City 3-0 Man Utd - Sergio Aguero (47 mins)

    Manchester United must still be back in the dressing room somewhere. A determined Aleksandar Kolorov feeds Alvaro Negredo who holds off his man on the byeline and clips a lofted cross to the back post where Sergio Aguero side-foots home a volley in glorious isolation. United's defence were in tatters. 6-1 anyone?

  82. 1703: 
    KICK-OFF- Man City 2-0 Man Utd

    We are under way at the Etihad.

  83. 1701: 
    Man City 2-0 Man Utd
    Manchester City

    Manchester City re-emerge to their fans singing the Beatles' 'Hey Jude'.


    Scott, Liverpool, via mobile on 81111: "City playing like this makes United seem a very average team. Makes me wonder why they can't maintain this form consistently."

  85. 1658: 
    FIRST HALF STATS ROUND-UP- Man City 2-0 Man Utd

    Another one to stick in your statistical pipe and smoke is the fact that Marouane Fellaini has not touched the ball in either team's penalty box.

    It seems he takes 'box-to-box midfielder' to mean to the the edges of both penalty areas, but no further.

  86. 1658: 
    CHAMPIONSHIP UPDATE- Wigan 2-0 Ipswich

    It is all over at the DW Stadium as goals from home debutants Ryan Shotton and Nick Powell give Wigan victory over Ipswich. Shotton headed home the opener early in the first half and Latics keeper Scott Carson produced a number of fine saves to keep the visitors at bay before Powell tapped home a second late on.

    The win, Wigan's third of the season, moves them up to 11th in the Championship.

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    Chris Bailey: Well this is a disaster. Reminds me of when we had O' Shea and Fortune in midfield...

    Ste Maguire: Didn't City get Yaya Toure for around the same price as Fellaini? No comparison. Toure is better by a mile.

    Jules Purnell: This is exactly the kind of game United signed Fellaini for, and so far he's been completely ineffectual. City far superior.

  88. 1657: 
    Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Referee Mark Clattenburg was at the centre of a huddle of players as he came off the pitch at half-time. His decision to rule out Ben Turner's header amid a chaotic penalty box followed a marginal call on whether Spurs goalkeeper Hugo Lloris had handled outside the area.

  89. 1654:  
    Jonathan Pearce, BBC Match of the Day commentator at the Cardiff City StadiumCardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    "Another clean sheet for Spurs, but Malky Mackay will have thought Cardiff should be 1-0 up, but Ben Turner was denied by Aron Gunnarsson's foul on Hugo Lloris."

  90. 1652:  
    Gary Lineker on Twitter, BBC Sport
  91. 1652:  
    Phil McNulty, BBC Sport Chief Football Writer at Etihad StadiumMan City 2-0 Man Utd

    "Yaya Toure has been the symbol of Manchester City's complete supremacy in that first half so it is fitting he should give them the sort of lead their dominance deserves. He has ruled Marouane Fellaini with ease midfield and United have looked laboured - with Ashley Young, in particular, dreadful.

    "Wayne Rooney left the field at half-time looking red-faced and frustrated. And it is hard not to sympathise with him as he is carrying United's load almost single-handedly."

  92. 1651: 
    CHAMPIONSHIP UPDATE- Wigan 2-0 Ipswich (Nick Powell)

    At least one United players has found the net.

    Wigan are firmly on their way to a third league win of the season as Manchester United loanee Nick Powell gives them a 2-0 lead against Ipswich. The midfielder robbed visiting keeper Dean Gerken of the ball and tapped home from close range.

    That goal came minute after Latics keeper Scott Carson had produced a stunning save to keep out Christophe Berra's long-range effort.

  93. 1651: 
    HALF-TIME- Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Time for a pie and tea at the Cardiff City Stadium as well.

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    Sium Ghebru: Danny Welbeck reminds me of how I play football. Gets in the way of passes, barges into keepers and can't hit the ball cleanly.

    JR Ogwal: This derby has become a game of shadows; One team creating them and the other chasing. This is not The United we know.

    Khalid: Spurs really need to put chances away. We need to learn to kill teams off. AVB needs to have a strong word at HT. No Defoe????

  95. 1650: 
    HALF-TIME- Man City 2-0 Man Utd

    That is just about the final piece of action at the Etihad before the break. A real barn-stormer of a half for City and David Moyes has some job to scrape his deflated troops off the dressing room floor.

  96. 1646: 
    GOAL- Man City 2-0 Man Utd - Yaya Toure (45 mins)

    Just as United seems to have steadied the ship, the Etihad is rocking once again. Alvaro Negredo's header from a corner is going just wide, before Yaya Toure, who has lost the attentions of Marouane Fellaini, sticks out a knee to redirect the ball into the net.

  97. 1646: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Manchester United have a got a chance to apply a bit of pressure as the half comes to a close, but Yaya Toure heads away Wayne Rooney's set-piece before Ashley Young lobs the ball aimlessly back into the box, beyond his strikers and wide of Joe Hart's goal. United have been poor going forward.


    Bob, Essex, via mobile on 81111: "Did I just hear Mr Savage ask where United are going to get their goals from? That won't please Roy Hodgson with his 2 England strikers in the line-up."

  99. 1643: 
    SOCIAL MEDIA- Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    We have a live album of all today's Premier League action on the BBC Sport Facebook page. Share your thoughts or post your Manchester Derby predictions here.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 1-0 Man United

    "United's wingers (Young and Valencia) have offered absolutely nothing. I wouldn't be surprised if one came off. It's all so predictable from United."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  101. 1643: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Antonio Valencia picks up the ball from a Yaya Toure challenge on Wayne Rooney but, with the City defence back-pedalling in front of him, the former Wigan man drags his shot well wide to ironic cheers.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 1-0 Man United

    "Rooney's trying to dictate the game but you've got to feel sorry for him. He's trying to make things happen but Fellaini and Carrick are sitting deep - they've got to try and get forward."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  103. 1641: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    David de Gea, attempting to pick a path through a packed penalty area, fails to get a clean punch on successive Manchester City corners. His defenders bale him out of trouble though.

  104. 1639: 
    Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Over in south Wales, Cardiff have somehow managed to escaped Spurs' early dominance without conceding. The hosts are struggling to build anything in the last third themselves though.

  105. 1639:  
    Phil McNulty, BBC Sport Chief Football Writer at Etihad StadiumMan City 1-0 Man Utd

    "Manchester United manager David Moyes has cut an increasingly agitated figure as this first half has gone on. Manchester City are so much the better team, with Yaya Toure outshining Marouane Fellaini in midfield and Samir Nasri's roaming runs causing all sorts of problems.

    "If anything City will be disappointed they do not have a bigger advantage, such has been their superiority. The final pass has just eluded them on several occasions."

    Moyes and Pellegrini
  106. 1638: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Listen to the "absolutely sensational goal by Aguero" that got Manchester City up and running in the derby, as described by Radio 5 live's Alan Green.

  107. 1637: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Joe Hart spills a simple cross, but it is largely because he has been charged into by England team-mate Danny Welbeck. Free-kick rightly awarded. The City goalkeeper has been untested so far.

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    Tommy Bridgford: Yaya Toure is the best all round player in the world. Size, strength and speed with great technical ability and a team player.

    Barney Cunningham: This is quite depressing... Some Manchester United players are simply not good enough.

    Simao B: Fellaini is a good buy but Utd still lack that someone who can push on from the midfield with the ball at their feet.

  109. 1635: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Manchester City's probing of United's defence has been an clever, skilful interrogation. Alvaro Negredo is almost onto another weighted throughball after Ashley Young has to slide in to clear with a host of light blue shirts poised to strike in the box.

  110. 1633: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Manchester United have finally got a hold of the ball. It is about buying time to clear their heads as much as anything.

    Patrice Evra briefly thinks he has got the wrong side of Jesus Navas down the left, but the ball has strayed out of play for a City throw-in.


    Paul, Cambridge, via mobile on 81111: "If United continue to play like this, the game will be over by half time. United need to start attacking decently."

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 1-0 Man United

    "Wayne Rooney is being muscled out the game by Vincent Kompany. He's a frustrated figure and he needs to calm down."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  113. 1631: 
    YELLOW CARD- Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Wayne Rooney finally exhausts Howard Webb's patience. His name goes into the book for an untidy tackle from behind on Vincent Kompany. The City crowd roar their approval.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 1-0 Man United

    "City are causing United all kinds of problems when they've got the ball. Kolarov's making some storming runs forward. The United players aren't doing their jobs all over the pitch."

    You can listen to live commentary on Radio 5 live.

  115. 1630: 
    PENALTY APPEAL- Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Alvaro Negredo blasts the ball into Nemanja Vidic from point-blank range, but there is nothing doing from Howard Webb. United are scrabbling around for a foothold in the game.

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    Rick Nash: These are the types of games Fellaini needs to be owning in the middle.

    Matthew Scott: Fellaini looking out of his depth here. More City goals incoming.

    ...and from Cardiff City v Spurs:

    Miracle Roch: Cardiff can't keep the ball! Tottenham are turning this into a shooting practice.

  117. 1628: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Manchester City almost punch through the United defence again as Sergio Aguero's beautifully-disguised little through ball beats the opposition rearguard, but runs just behind Samir Nasri.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 1-0 Man United

    "The problem for me with United is the amount of people they get into the (City) box. It was same against Leverkusen. The best goal they scored then was the last one when they broke up the pitch with pace. But that hasn't happened at all today."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Radio 5 live.

    Man City v Man United

    OptaJoe: 9 - There were nine shots in the opening quarter of the Man City v Man Utd game, all of them coming from City. Dominate.

  120. 1625: 
    Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    The City fans are up on their feet demanding action from Howard Webb. Wayne Rooney has already irritated them by booting the ball into a sprawling Sergio Aguero after the whistle had blown and then gets involved in a tussle with Vincent Kompany as they contest a high ball. The United man's protective headband comes off in the shoving.

    He gets a stern talking-to from Webb as he rearranges his headwear, but no more.

  121. 1623:  
    Phil McNulty, BBC Sport Chief Football Writer at Etihad StadiumANALYSIS- Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    "The big question was how Manchester United would cope without Robin van Persie - the bigger problem for manager David Moyes is that they are struggling to cope in midfield and defence. Manchester City are much sharper, move positive and are swarming all over United.

    "Wayne Rooney has not had any service worthy of the name and is already shown some signs of frustration."

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    Richard Powell: Clinical volley from Aguero having just escaped death when Rooney kicked the ball at him!

    Tunde Akere: What a move! What a goal from Aguerooooooo. The finish is absolutely fantastic. Typical Aguero goal.

    Russell Reynolds: Can't blame Smalling for that, Valencia needs to track back and cover.

  123. 1623: 
    Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Tottenham are almost in front in Cardiff as Christian Eriksen's shot trickles just wide after David Marshall's fails to hold the Dane's low effort. Spurs are on top so far.

  124. 1620: 
    CLOSE!- Man City 1-0 Man Utd

    Manchester City have United on the ropes and are piling in the punches. Samir Nasri latches onto a dropping ball just inside the area and crashes a volley a foot over. That was travelling. David de Gea would have had no chance.

    Robbie Savage on BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad StadiumMan City 1-0 Man United

    "Well that goal's come from a poor defensive header from Rio Ferdinand. Aguero's volley was similar to Aluko's for Hull yesterday. The ball's almost behind him but he's been able to turn and hit it left-footed. Great start from City and a great goal."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Radio 5 live.

  126. 1616: 
    GOAL- Man City 1-0 Man Utd - Sergio Aguero (16 mins)

    A cheeky finish from Sergio Aguero gives Manchester City the lead that their early dominance threatened. Aleksandar Kolarov's cross was behind the Argentine, but he rearranges his limbs just in time to stretch back and flick the ball over his shoulder and into the net.

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    I.Am.Emmanuel: Nastacic looks like a red-card candidate.

    Russell Reynolds: Very hard working line up for United. Disciplined look about it. Not expecting a high scoring game.

    Varuth Kuonsongtham: Aguero and Negredo are starting to play well together. This could become very dangerous

  128. 1614: 
    Man City 0-0 Man Utd

    Finally Manchester United win the ball back, but their attempt to counter is short-lived with Chris Smalling mis-directing a pass to Marouane Fellaini. Worrying times for the visitors.

  129. 1612: 
    Man City 0-0 Man Utd

    Manchester City are starting to put their foot on the ball and play. Sergio Aguero is looking neat and tidy and United are struggling to get a sniff.

  130. 1610: 
    Cardiff 0-0 Tottenham

    Fraizer Campbell is clean through on Tottenham's goal after pouncing on Kyle Naughton's undercooked backpass. Hugo Lloris is out quickly to sprawl at his feet and get a touch and take it away from the Cardiff striker. It looked like he may have handled outside the box, but the Spurs stopper gets the benefit of the doubt.

    At the other end, Roberto Soldado has punted a decent chance straight at David Marshall.

    Robbie Savage, BBC Radio 5 liveMan City v Man United

    "That's harsh. Nastasic will be on tenterhooks for the rest of the game, that should never have been a yellow card from Howard Webb."

  132. 1607: 
    YELLOW CARD- Man City 0-0 Man Utd

    Matija Nastasic is the first name taken by referee Howard Webb after a robust aerial charge on Chris Smalling. The crowd don't like it much. Predictably enough.

    Robbie Savage, BBC Radio 5 live at Etihad StadiumMan City v Man United

    "It's been a very, very good start from United. They are playing with pace and power."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Radio 5 live.

  134. 1605: 
    Man City 0-0 Man Utd

    Manchester United are a little too casual as they attempt to play out of defence. Nemanja Vidic's pass is cut out by Jesus Navas. The Spaniard snatches at his shot from 25 yards and sends it over the top.

  135. 1604: 
    Man City 0-0 Man Utd

    Manchester City force the game's first corner and Chris Smalling does well to get up and head clear under pressure.

  136. 1603: 
    Man City 0-0 Man Utd

    Manchester United are looking bright with that man Wayne Rooney eager for work. He drops into midfield and feeds Danny Welbeck, but the United striker loses his footing as he attempts to swivel to face goal.

  137. 1601: 
    KICK-OFF- Cardiff v Tottenham (1600 BST)

    Spurs could be top by the end of today. They are under way against Cardiff.

  138. 1601: 
    KICK-OFF- Man City 0-0 Man Utd

    We are off and running and Danny Welbeck immediately snaps around the heels of Vincent Kompany, getting a block in and almost forcing a corner.

  139. 1600: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    Robin van Persie looks on from the stands as his team-mates line up. City to get us going.

  140. 1558: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    The teams step out into a sunny autumnal afternoon at the Etihad. The Manchester United line-up is drowned in jeers as it is read out over the tannoy.

    Now time for the City names.

    "In goal, England's number one, Joe Hart!"

    Robbie Savage, BBC Radio 5 live at Etihad StadiumMan City v Man United

    "Yaya Toure v Fellaini will be interesting, Carrick and Fellaini will sit and expect Yaya Toure to make runs onto them."

  142. 1556: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    Aleksandar Kolarov taps fellow Serbia international and Nemanja Vidic on the shoulder as the City side file out to take their place alongside Manchester United in the tunnel. Vidic gives his mate a hug and a smile. But the game face is soon back in place

    Time for business.

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    Ed Gutteridge: No United fans that watch our matches would be disappointed to see Welbeck starting. He has got it.

    Chris Parker: Wonder if Hernandez will go in January, too good of a player to be left out this much.

    Mohammed Salah: In some way I'm happy that RVP is injured so that we can prove that we are not a one man team

  144. 1554: 
    HALF TIME- Wigan 1-0 Ipswich

    Half time in today's solitary Championship fixture, with Wigan leading Ipswich 1-0 thanks to Ryan Shotton's early header. The Latics have had Scott Carson to thank for protecting their slender advantage, with the former Liverpool goalkeeper having produced a number of fine saves to keep Ipswich at bay.


    From Lee in Nottingham via mobile on 81111: Defoe not even on the bench? Is he injured? Strange move from AVB!! Defoe will be on a high after scoring in midweek!

  146. 1553:  
    Jonathan Pearce, BBC Match of the Day commentator at Cardiff City StadiumCardiff v Tottenham (1600 BST)

    "Cardiff look the most likely of the promoted trio to stay up. But however sticky it gets, they must keep faith with Malky Mackay. They've allowed him to spend. Now they must trust in a bright, young manager.

    "He may not be as close to the summit of English football as Andre Villas-Boas, but he's done a great job bringing Cardiff back to the top flight after 51 years. Both men are richly deserving, but AVB should take the spoils here."

  147. 1552: 
    Cardiff v Tottenham (1600 BST)
    Vincent Tan

    The atmosphere is not quite as heady at the Cardiff City Stadium, but the home side's owner Vincent Tan is in place with his immaculately prepared moustache, red shirt and high waistband.

  148. 1549:  
    Robbie Savage, BBC Radio 5 live at the Etihad

    "I think City have been very poor, they beat a poor Newcastle side, if Hull had had a striker they could have been beaten, they were beaten at Cardiff and only drew at Stoke. He (Pellegrini) has to win a trophy this season, look at what happened to Roberto Mancini when he didn't."

  149. 1548: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    Manchester City manager Manuel Pellegrini, speaking to Sky Sports: "Alvaro Negredo starts. Edin Dzeko had a very good match in the Champions League, but we are always making some rotation and for this game I think it is better to start with Negredo. They are different players. They are both strikers. I must trust both of them and they are both in a very good moment."

  150. 1548: 

    The Etihad Stadium's big screens have just been reliving Manchester City's 6-1 walloping of United back in October 2011..

    The City players have just headed back inside for their final instructions. The next time they emerge it will be alongside United for kick-off.

  151. 1545: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)
    Former Manchester United boss Ron Atkinson

    It is almost 27 years since the last Manchester derby without Sir Alex Ferguson in the United dug-out. Nick Berry was at number one in October 1986 with 'Every Loser Wins' when Ron Atkinson's United side arrived at City's old Maine Road Ground with both clubs in the bottom three.

    "The thing that always makes me laugh when I remember these games is that our coach driver Derek - or Del Boy as we used to call him - would drive us to Maine Road and then go and sit on the City bench," Atkinson told BBC Sport.

    That 1986 meeting was the first Manchester derby to be televised live. You can read more about Del Boy, hear what City defender John Gidman said to put United winger Peter Barnes off his game and find out what else was very different about City and United at the time, here.

  152. 1545: 

    I'm sure that if he is not secreted somewhere on enemy territory, sir Alex Ferguson will be settling into his easy chair for the first derby since the end of his reign.

    The last one that he wasn't involved him was way back in the mid eighties...

  153. 1542: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)
    David Moyes

    Manchester United manager David Moyes, speaking to Sky Sports about Robin van Persie: "He had a groin strain during the week. I thought he might have been Ok today, but not quite. We gave it every chance up until this morning. It is nothing serious. He could have a chance for Wednesday [against Liverpool in the League Cup]."

  154. 1542: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)
    Vincent Kompany

    Manchester City captain Vincent Kompany, speaking to Sky Sports: "I was looking towards last week's game in the Champions League to ensure I got minutes so I could play in the derby. It is a big day for everyone in Manchester. It will be a good game, I am sure whatever the outcome there will be drama as always."

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    Danyal Nasir: Welbeck over Hernandez & Young over Kagawa ...Moyes need to sort it out.

    Luke Wander: Hoping for an early birthday present today: 3 points to the red half of Manchester! Couldn't survive in rural China without #bbcfootball.

    Chris Mann: I'm feeling more optimistic that Palace will stay up for 3 seasons - Autumn, Winter and Spring...

  156. 1537: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    Ashley Young needs to come to the party for Manchester United today. For my viewing, he has done little to justify his place in the visitors' line-up.

    I know he arrived with a bit of an injury but Stefan Jovetic seems to have been given the gentlest of introductions by Manuel Pellegrini as well. The Montenegro international has played a little over an hour for his new side so far this season.

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    Oliver Cook: Would have been nice to see Kagawa given the chance to play behind Rooney today with RVP not playing.

    Steven Brown: Can't help but wonder if there was a little cheer amongst the city players now that Van Persie is out.

    Nathan Mann: It's been coming United! A year of a fully fit Van Persie, then for the most crucial game of their season, he gets injured!

    Phil McNulty, BBC Sport Chief Football Writer at Etihad StadiumMan City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    "The absence of Robin van Persie from Manchester United's side with a thigh strain places even greater emphasis on Wayne Rooney - but his form this season proves the England striker is more than capable of assuming that responsibility in today's derby at Etihad Stadium.

    "Manchester City manager Manuel Pellegrini has gone for summer signing Alvaro Negredo in attack but there is a blow for them as David Silva has failed to recover from a thigh problem."

  159. 1534: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    Right, less than half and hour until go-time at the Etihad.

    If Romeo and Juliet thought their getting together caused a bit of a stir in Verona, they had clearly never been in Manchester when United and City met up.

    John Motson, BBC Match of the Day commentator at the Emirates StadiumArsenal 3-1 Stoke

    "Arsenal make it four league wins in a row and it was a comfortable afternoon for Arsene Wenger's side. Stoke were in game until 2-1 and had plenty of possession, but then Bacary Sagna's second-half headed goal settled the match."

    Nigel Adderley, Match of the Day 2 commentator at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "Crystal Palace were chasing shadows from the majority of the match and the gap in quality between the two sides was a very big one. Swansea controlled possession for long periods and probably should have won by a greater margin.

    "Visiting goalkeeper Michel Vorm was rarely troubled by Crystal Palace, who looked desperately short of ideas up front which will be a worry for Ian Holloway. Michu, on the other hand, was inspired for Swansea."

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "Swansea just keep getting better and better. Ok, they weren't stretched today but it was another thoroughly professional performance from them.

    "Palace need to win games to stay in this division. They need more width and more balance. They didn't have enough players in the opposition box and that's why Swansea were so comfortable."

  163. 1530: 

    As it stands Arsenal are top of the league, two points clear of Liverpool and Chelsea.

    For all the focus on the Manchester derby, and there is plenty coming your way, only north London rivals Tottenham , who play Cardiff in half an hour's time, can topple them before the weekend is out.

  164. 1528: 
    Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    A long, hard season they normally say for newly promoted Championship sides. I fear for Palace it could be such a hard season, that it is effectively quite short. The gig could be up for them in late March or so.

  165. 1525: 
    FULL-TIME- Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    Dwight Gayle's scuffed shot is the final action of the match.

  166. 1524: 
    FULL-TIME- Arsenal 3-1 Stoke

    Done and dusted at the Emirates.

  167. 1524: 
    Arsenal 3-1 Stoke

    Arsenal almost craft a fourth as Olivier Giroud pivots cleverly and plays in Aaron Ramsey. But the Welshman goes for power from a tight angle and his effort fizzes over the top.

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "I just want to grab Marouane Chamakh and shake him. I want to say 'hello, can you actually keep hold of the ball and bring others into play?'. No wonder they got rid of him at Arsenal."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.

  169. 1522: 
    Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    The last splutterings of this Crystal Palace performance as Jose Campana blasts over from 20 yards out.

  170. 1521: 
    Cardiff v Tottenham (1600 BST)

    Craig Bellamy returns up front for Cardiff, while David Marshall is back in goal with both players having recovered from leg injuries. Don Cowie drops to the bench and Joe Rees makes way for Marshall.

    Tottenham make one change to the team that beat Norwich 2-0 in their last top-flight encounter with Kyle Naughton coming into the defence in Danny Rose's place. Summer signings Paulhino, Roberto Soldado and Christian Eriksen are also in Spurs' starting line-up.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    The team selections for the Manchester derby are already causing a bit of chatter...

    Karl Cobane: Kolarov in the City team. No clean sheet for us today then.

    Sanj: RVP out...just when I thought that game couldn't become more dull...MUFC gonna be more defensive than usual #PainfulViewing

    Mutelo R M: Over to you Wazza.

    Robbie Savage, BBC Radio 5 live pundit at Etihad StadiumMan City v Man United

    "It's a huge advantage to Man City, with Van Persie not playing Rooney will play behind Welbeck. It will suit Welbeck, but you have to say that's advantage Man City. If you're in the dressing room and you see there's no Van Persie, that will give you a lift."

  173. 1520: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    The big news ahead of the derby concerns Robin van Persie, with the Dutch striker not included in the Manchester United squad to face Manchester City. Instead, Wayne Rooney starts alongside Danny Welbeck in attack. Meanwhile Marouane Fellaini makes his first Premier League start for the reigning Premier League champions.

    For Manchester City, Alvaro Negrado starts in attack as manager Manuel Pellegrini make four changes the side that drew 0-0 with Stoke City last weekend. David Silva has failed to recover from a thigh injury so misses out, but Vincent Kompany, Fernandinho, Jesus Navas and Sergio Aguero all start.

  174. 1520: 
    CHAMPIONSHIP UPDATE- Wigan 1-0 Ipswich (Ryan Shotton)

    Wigan appear to be showing no ill affects from their European exploits in midweek as they take the lead after just 12 minutes against Ipswich. Manchester United loanee Nick Powell whips in a corner towards the far post where right-back Ryan Shotton pops up to head home the opener.

  175. 1519: 
    INJURY TIME- Arsenal 3-1 Stoke

    We are heading into injury time in both games. Stoke have been trying manfully to force their way back into the game, but a Stephen Ireland volley over the top apart, they have not had any sight of goal.

    Five minutes extra at Selhurst Park and four at the Emirates.

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "It's been a fragmented performance (from Palace). It's been 11 individuals trying their best but without any end product."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.


    Pete the Posh fan via mobile on 81111: "Surely you have to question wisdom of Holloway spending £6 million on Gayle? No Prem experience and only a good 6 months with The Posh?"

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "If you're creating stuff and missing chances, you've got something to hold on to. But I've seen Palace twice this season and I haven't seen them create a chance. You're going to have to score goals to stay in this league."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.

  179. 1517: 
    Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    Crystal Palace's fans are still in good voice, but it is in spite of their team's performance rather than because of it. Swansea are still bossing it and Michu should really have made it three. The Spaniard dawdled a little too long in the box, allowing Mile Jedinak to get in a challenge.

    LINE-UPS- Cardiff v Tottenham (1600 BST)

    Cardiff: Marshall, Theophile-Catherine, Turner, Caulker, Taylor, Gunnarsson, Bellamy, Medel, Kim, Whittingham, Campbell. Subs: Hudson, Odemwingie, Mutch, Cowie, Mason, Maynard, Lewis.

    Tottenham: Lloris, Walker, Dawson, Vertonghen, Naughton, Paulinho, Dembele, Townsend, Eriksen, Sigurdsson, Soldado. Subs: Chiriches, Lamela, Holtby, Friedel, Fryers, Kane, Sandro.

    Referee: Mark Clattenburg (Tyne & Wear)

  181. 1514: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Arsenal 3-1 Stoke

    Arsene Wenger has brought Mesut Ozil's home debut to an end, bringing on Mikel Arteta in his place.

  182. 1513: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    Manchester City manager Manuel Pellegrini, speaking to Sky Sports about Robin van Persie not being named in the Manchester United side: "Robin van Persie is a very important player for Manchester United, but they have other important players also."

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "There's a real shape to this Swansea side. It's not just 11 players thrown on the pitch. They've got width, they've got pace and quality at the back. Everyone is comfortable in the position they're playing".

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.

  184. 1512: 
    Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    With no room for Robin van Persie on the bench either, you would have to presume that there is an injury to the Dutchman. Wayne Rooney was good in midweek, but not so good to kick van Persie all the way down to the reserves.

  185. 1509: 
    BREAKING TEAM NEWS- Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    Manchester United striker Robin van Persie not included in the squad for the Manchester derby.

  186. 1509: 
    DISALLOWED GOAL- Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    Swansea are still looking hungry for more goals. Michu burst onto a Jonathan Guzman pass and slots home, but has mistimed his run a fraction to be caught offside. Palace are so flaky at the back.

  187. 1504: 
    LINE-UPS- Man City v Man Utd (1600 BST)

    Man City: Hart, Zabaleta, Kompany, Nastasic, Kolarov, Fernandinho, Toure, Nasri, Navas, Aguero, Negredo. Subs: Pantilimon, Lescott, Richards, Garcia, Milner, Jovetic, Dzeko

    Man Utd: De Gea, Evra, Ferdinand, Rooney, Smalling, Vidic, Carrick, Young, Welbeck, Valencia, Fellaini. Subs: Amos, Evans, Hernandez, Nani, Cleverley, Kagawa, Buttner

    Referee: Howard Webb (S Yorkshire)

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    Shaun Roddis: Sagna & Mikel score within 24hrs of each other. Keep an eye out for the four horsemen of the apocalypse.

    Mathew Penistone: One team is playing lovely football, the other has scored from three set pieces. Its Arsenal V Stoke Jim, but not as we know it!

    Nick Clohessy: Say what you like about Pulis' style: Stoke never conceded 3 set pieces in a game when he was in charge.

  189. 1506: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Arsenal 3-1 Stoke

    Arsenal have made a double substitution in the wake of that goal with Serge Gnabry and Jack Wilshere giving way to Nacho Monreal and Ryo Miyaichi.

  190. 1501: 
    GOAL- Arsenal 3-1 Stoke - Bacary Sagna (72 mins)

    Arsenal score another goal from a set-piece. Mesut Ozil has been behind all of them, but it has been more the hosts' aerial strength that has stood out. Bacary Sagna climbs highest to meet a free-kick at the far post and plant the header past Asmir Begovic. That might put the cosh on Stoke's hopes. They were playing well before that though.

    Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    Former Crystal Palace, Swansea City and Wales striker Ian Walsh on BBC Radio Wales: "I'm a non-smoker, but I might get my own cigars out in a moment."

  192. 1501: 
    Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    Dwight Gayle, who has only been on the field for a few minutes, comes as close as any Palace player has done. The former Peterborough man fires just wide from 20 yards.

  193. 1500: 
    Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    Stoke are still keeping Arsenal pinned back though as they monopolise possession and territory. There are about 20 minutes to go if Arsenal can hang on. They would want a more stylish route to victory however.

  194. 1458: 
    Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    Stand down Arsenal fans. Jack Wilshere is back on the field and looks to be moving ok.

  195. 1457: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    Crystal Palace bring off Cameron Jerome and Barry Bannan and throw Dwight Gayle and Jerome Thomas into the mix. Will that revive Ian Holloway's side? I fear not.

  196. 1455: 
    Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    A worrying and familiar sight for Arsenal as Jack Wilshere is laid out on the turf after catching his foot in a snapping challenge by Steven Nzonzi.

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "Swansea just have better players. They just make the game look easier. There's more movement.

    "There's nothing wrong with Palace's work effort but there's a lack of quality going forward, a lack of cutting edge."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.

    Swansea celebrate
  198. 1453: 
    Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    It is a strange sentence to write but Arsenal have been struggling for possession against Stoke in the last five minutes.

    To further confuse the matter the Gunners then go close with some classic Route One. A big goal-kick, flick-ons by Oiveir Giroud and Jack Wilshere, before Mesut Ozil fires into Asmir Begovic's shins from a tight angle.

  199. 1449: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    Swansea are also shuffling the pack with Jonathan de Guzman on in place of Alvaro Vazquez. It has been a decent performance by Vazquez.

  200. 1448: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    Arsenal have just been a final pass away from cracking open the Stoke defence.

    Meanwhile Stoke are making a change with a peeved looking Charlie Adam replaced by Stephen Ireland.

    Crystal Palace v Swansea

    Dan 'the big eagle' Clare, central Reading, via mobile on 81111: "Getting really distressed about Palace: both scoreline and performance. Lack of top quality. Championship here we come?"

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "(Palace manager) Ian Holloway has to change it. They could be here for a year and not score. They've got to get more men in the box."

    "Swansea have had four or five outstanding opportunities but Palace have had none."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.

  203. 1446: 
    Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    Swansea tear the Crystal Palace defence to shreds once again. Palace are chasing shadows as Alvaro Vazquez blazes over the top after snappy interplay between his team-mates. Swansea should be out of sight and still might be by the end of the match.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    Will Moores: Wonder what conspiracy or refereeing decision Ian Holloway can blame this defeat on?

    Matthew Bott: Sat in my apartment in Jakarta, Indonesia gutted I can't find anywhere to watch the derby. Live text is a life saver.

    Graham Keller: My daughter's first derby today. She's dead excited! I'm dead nervous.

  205. 1444: 
    YELLOW CARD- Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    Arsenal fashion the first real opening of the second half as Olivier Giroud forces Asmir Begovic into a stretching stop with a decent hit from 25 yards.

    The time and space for the Frenchman came about after Serge Gnabry stole the ball off Marc Wilson. The German was then laid low by a brutal body-check from Robert Huth which referee Mike Dean rightly goes back to book him for.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball
    Etihad fan zone

    Tim Hague: Great atmosphere at the Etihad. Oasis blasting out from the stage and people are buzzing.

  207. 1441: 
    YELLOW CARDS- Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    There was a little bit of a scuffle and kerfuffle as Angel Rangel and Marouane Chamakh both have their names taken after a spot of push and shove.

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-2 Swansea

    "This is deja vu. It's exactly the same as the start of the first half. Swansea have torn Palace apart. This game is over."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.

  209. 1436: 
    GOAL- Crystal Palace 0-2 Swansea - Nathan Dyer (48 mins)

    Swansea are immediately up and at Crystal Palace and have picked the hosts' defence apart for a second. Michu times an outside-of-the-foot pass to perfection for Alvaro Vazquez and the Spain Under-21 international in turn lays the ball into the path of Nathan Dyer after his initial shot was well blocked by Julian Speroni. Dyer can't miss from eight yards in front of an unguarded goal.

  210. 1434: 

    Back under way in both games.

  211. 1434: 
    SUBSTITUTION- Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    Crystal Palace make a change before the second half kicks off with Damien Delaney forced off and recent arrival Jose Campana ushered on in his place.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    Capital R: Having to do the tourist sightseeing in New York & keep up to date with the scores via #BBCFootball - grateful for the live text

    BoyRapho: Bacary Sagna is the most predictable RB in RBing history

    Hafiz Braimah: C'mon Arsenal! I want to watch the Manchester derby knowing we top of the table. No slip ups. C'mon Giroud.

    Keep the comments coming in, and if you're arriving at either the Etihad Stadium, the Cardiff City Stadium or the DW Stadium for today's other games, send us a photo and we'll post a selection of the best on here. #bbcfootball

  213. 1432: 

    Arsenal and Germany's Lukas Podolski, out of contention for the match with a hamstring injury, has taken the chance to nip up to the posh seats and do a little schmoozing with his international manager Joachim Loew during the interval.

    It's all about building those networks. Maybe that is where Stefan Kiessling has gone wrong.

    Nigel Adderley, Match of the Day 2 commentator at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "Swansea are well on top here at Selhurst Park. They might only have a one-goal lead at the break but Michael Laudrup will feel his side should be out of sight given their dominance. Michu scored after 81 seconds with his third goal in six days, and Crystal Palace's Julian Speroni has certainly been much the busier of the two goalkeepers."

    John Motson, BBC Match of the Day commentator at the Emirates StadiumArsenal 2-1 Stoke

    MOTD's John Motson at Emirates Stadium: "Plenty of action in the first half, most of it for Arsenal. Aaron Ramsey put the hosts in front and they were shocked when Geoff Cameron equalised but Per Mertesacker's header restored Arsenal's lead."

    BBC Radio 5 live Sports Extra pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "Palace have worked their way back into the game without really convincing. They need a bit more quality in the final third, which is always hard.

    "They're not quite as open defensively as they were in those first ten minutes. But in terms of threatening the Swansea goal, that's where they've come up short."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.


    Bob the City Fan, via mobile on 81111: My mates have both worked 80 hours each at McDonald's to take me to the Etihad for my birthday. Please God don't let that be in vain.

    Man has no greater love than that.

  218. 1421: 
    HALF-TIME- Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    The teams head down the tunnel and Stoke need a fiery team-talk from boss Mark Hughes's team talk, as well as a tea with two sugars, to get themselves up and running.

  219. 1419: 
    Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    Arsenal are seeing out the rest of the first half with a little filibustering play between the two centre-backs.

  220. 1419: 

    You can make your predictions for the Manchester derby this afternoon via the BBC Sport Facebook page. Tell us what the score is going to be and predict who will be the first goalscorer.

  221. 1418: 
    HALF-TIME- Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    The whistle blows for the end of the first half at Selhurst Park.

  222. 1418: 
    Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    Swansea are still looking a class above Palace. The Swans are containing their hosts in defence and look the more dangerous in attack with Michu buzzing around threatening every time they come forward.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball
    Arsenal goal

    Krishan Goyal: Stoke conceding from two set pieces. This really is a very different Stoke side

    Richard Powell: Has Begovic been kidnapped and replaced by a look-alike? Stoke conceding from 2 set-pieces just doesn't happen!

    Dan Gibbs: How many times is 'The king of the assist' going to be thrown around for this boy Ozil? He is amazing

    BBC Sport pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "Palace have come back into the game. They're trying to see how they can make an impression on the Swansea goal."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on 5 live Sports Extra.

  225. 1415: 

    It is back to Championship football for Wigan, who host Ipswich at 1500 BST, following their European venture in midweek. Owen Coyle's side earned a credible draw at Belgians Zulte Waregem but they will be hoping their Europa League exploits do not detract from what will likely be their main goal this season - promotion.

    They have been consistently inconsistent in the league so far this season, winning two, drawing two and losing two of their six games, but statistics bode well for the home side for this clash. They are unbeaten at home while Mick McCarthy's Ipswich have yet to win on the road.

  226. 1415: 
    Arsenal 2-1 Stoke

    Erik Pieters almost tears the shirt off the back of Arsenal's Serge Gnabry in his attempt to dispossess the German down by the Stoke corner flag. Pieters looks shocked when the decision goes against him, but I think the referee probably feared a charge of indecent exposure had the tussle gone on any longer.


    Kevin Southernwood via mobile on 81111: "Sitting at a ferret show in Nottingham with my partner, BBC app only thing keeping me sane!!! C'mon Utd!"

  228. 1412: 
    Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    Chances at both ends. But, in keeping with the general play, Swansea's have been a little higher-quality than Palace's.

    After Adlene Guedioura warms Michel Vorm's palms with a straight-struck effort from a 30-yard free-kick, Angel Rangel thumps a screaming volley goalwards which Julian Speroni has to go full-length to push away.

  229. 1406: 
    GOAL- Arsenal 2-1 Stoke - Per Mertesacker (36 mins)

    Per Mertesacker puts the Gunners back in front with a little help from centre-back colleague Laurent Koscielny. Mertesacker's muscular header looped into the far corner, but might not have got there had Koscielny not tried and failed to get a touch en route. His attempt distracted Asmir Begovic.

    Arsenal celebrate
  230. 1405: 
    Arsenal 1-1 Stoke

    Arsenal have responded well to being pegged back. The gangly Per Mertesacker leans into a near-post header from a corner, but his glancing effort is cleared by Erik Peters. Asmir Begovic might not have got there if his defender hadn't.

    BBC Sport pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "There have been very few flops at Swansea in the past couple of years. Everyone seems to have been brought in with a purpose and they've taken the club to the next level."

    You can listen to commentary of this match on Sports Extra.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    Rick Nash: That's it, I'm writing Arsenal off.

    Mark_Lynch: Whoops! Nice one stoke!

    Amir Hamza Watching Manchester derby in Peshawar (Pakistan). RVP and Toure to grab the headlines!!

  233. 1402: 
    Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    Michu is looking Swansea's likeliest source of a second goal. The Spaniard's shot flies just over the top from the edge of the box after he is fed by the lively Wayne Routledge from the left.

    BBC Sport pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "It's a bits and pieces sort of game. Palace have given the ball away a bit cheaply. If you keep giving the ball away you'll eventually get punished again."

  235. 1357: 
    GOAL- Arsenal 1-1 Stoke - Geoff Cameron (26 mins)

    That has put a dampener on the noise in the Emirates. Marko Arnautovic runs off the back of Per Mertesacker and is picked out by lovely lofted ball from Steven Nzonzi. The Austrian volleys against the post, but Geoff Cameron, following up, fires between two defenders and beyond the reach of the goalkeeper to level. That is the American international's first goal for the club.

  236. 1357: 
    Arsenal 1-0 Stoke

    Kieran Gibbs twists and turns Jonathan Walters one way and then the other, but the Arsenal full-back's effort at the end of it doesn't match what came before. Over it goes.

  237. 1355: 

    We have a live album of all today's Premier League action on the BBC Sport Facebook page. Share your thoughts or post your predictions here.

  238. 1355: 
    Arsenal 1-0 Stoke

    Bacary Sagna trips Charlie Adam right on the very edge of the penalty area to put Arsenal under pressure from a tricky free-kick out wide. The Stoke heavy cavalry rolls up from the back but the home side see off the danger.

    As ever the visitors are posing a significant aerial threat though.

  239. 1353: 
    Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    Jason Puncheon blasts a free-kick into the wall before Adrian Mariappa lashes over the top. Crystal Palace are still being restricted to long-range efforts but they are getting closer.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    Sean J Campbell: Text updates of early games on sunny beach in Barcelona then heading to my local Irish bar for battle of Manchester.

    Jay ‏@jayonlines: Jack Wilshere is an absolute foul magnet. He really shouldn't play without an Iron Man suit (de-weaponized, of course)

    Andrew Askew: Arsenal scoring early has ruined stokes plan A, so will they have a plan B?

    BBC Sport pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "When you think about what Spurs did when they came to Palace, it took them an age to get going and they never really opened them up. But already we've seen Swansea create far more and we've only played 10 minutes."

  242. 1351: 
    Arsenal 1-0 Stoke

    Stoke are also staging a bit of a recovery. Some neat play around the fringes of the box through Marko Arnautovic, before they revert to the old-school play-book and fling in a cross for Kenwyne Jones. Wojciech Szczesny takes it cleanly, but his trailing leg is caught by Jones. Daggers shot from the Arsenal goalkeeper at Jones, but nothing more.

    BBC Sport pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "I don't think Michael Laudrup would have minded playing in this Swansea side. They play in the same mould as he played the game."

  244. 1347: 
    Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    Crystal Palace string a bit of play together after being on the rack for the opening 10 minutes. Adrian Mariappa, overlapping down the left flank, sends over a cross for Marouane Chamakh, but it is a little overcooked for the Moroccan.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball
    Aaron Ramsey

    Terryfic Otobong: Oh! Rambo Aaron're the BEST midfielder in Wales, in Europe & in the world!

    Rick Nash: You'd be a fool to write Arsenal off in an open Premier League season like this. I know we say that every year but still…

    Jacob Beechey: Sat in the sun in Cyprus watching the football before flying home. Arsenal and city to win!

  246. 1345: 
    Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    Boss Ian Holloway has chosen to take up a position behind the goal that Crystal Palace are defending rather than up in the gods for the final match of his touchline ban.

  247. 1343: 
    Arsenal 1-0 Stoke

    Jack Wilshere is looking a little lame. The midfielder is hobbling slightly and holding the back of his leg. Time for Mikel Arteta to make a comeback?

  248. 1342: 
    BBC Sport pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "The problem for Palace is a) getting the right personnel but b) getting the right system. They're taking a little while to find the best 11 and the best system to suit the players they've got. It's not working for them so far today."

  249. 1341: 
    HITS THE WOODWORK- Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    While Arsenal were opening the scoring in north London, Swansea were close to a second in the south of the city with Chico Flores stabbing the ball against the post from six yards as a corner flew through to him. Swansea well on top at the moment.

  250. 1336: 
    GOAL- Arsenal 1-0 Stoke - Aaron Ramsey (5 mins)

    Aaron Ramsey had already collected his biggest ever haul of goals in a single season before kick-off. He now has seven in eight as he fires low past Asmir Begovic from six yards out. The Bosnian goalkeeper palmed away a Mesut Ozil free-kick in unconvincing style and was duly punished.

    BBC Sport pundit Steve Claridge at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace 0-1 Swansea

    "Fantastic start for a really positive looking Swansea side. Even in possession Crystal Palace are panicking and giving the ball away. You cannot do that against a team like Swansea."

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    Arthur Pickthorn: Forget the Manchester derby, today is all about the mighty Tractor Boys' trip to Wigan. Looking for a third straight win.

    Mike AVB Parker: Getting up nice and early (well 8.30am) in Sucre, Bolivia to watch Stoke, Spurs and Man Utd win

    Jonas Jalhay: Watching the Manchester derby with my grandad in Namur (Belgium) today... Lets see how the big Belgians will influence the game.

    Get in touch with your thoughts, theories and predictions on today's games, and if you're on the way or just arriving at a ground, send us a photo to #bbcfootball.

  253. 1333: 
    GOAL- Crystal Palace 0-1 Swansea - Michu (2 mins)

    Swansea are off to a flier. A slick team move ends with Michu firing past Julian Speroni and into the roof of the net.

  254. 1333: 
    Arsenal 0-0 Stoke

    Ryan Shawcross's first touch is roundly jeered by the Arsenal fans.

  255. 1331: 

    We are up and running in both games.

  256. 1330: 
    Crystal Palace v Swansea (1330 BST)

    There is a minute's applause for former Crystal Palace president Peter Morley before we get going at Selhurst Park.

  257. 1327: 
    LATE CHANGE- Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    There has been a late change to the Arsenal team with Serge Gnabry stepping up from the bench to replace an ill Theo Walcott. This is a big chance for the German to stake a claim. It is his first appearance of the season, his first since October 2012 in fact.

  258. 1326:  
    John Motson, BBC Match of the Day commentator at the Emirates Stadium

    "Eyes will be on Mesut Ozil making his home debut today but Aaron Ramsey really seems to have finally exorcised his injury demons after suffering a double leg break against Stoke in 2010.

    "There's been some bad blood between the two clubs in recent years, but with Mark Hughes replacing Tony Pulis as Stoke boss, it could be a bit different now - the issue of whether Stoke play 'dirty' should be diluted."


    Opta Joe: There have been 22 penalties (14 won, eight conceded) in Crystal Palace's last 41 games in the Premier League.

    Nigel Adderley, Match of the Day 2 commentator at Selhurst ParkCrystal Palace v Swansea (1330 BST)

    "The memories from Swansea's win over Valencia in the Mestalla will linger for a long time but the edge could be taken off the occasion for Michael Laudrup if Premier League points aren't taken against Crystal Palace in the less glamorous surroundings of Selhurst Park.

    "Palace boss Ian Holloway celebrated victory against Sunderland with an impromptu jig in the technical area but we'll be denied any touchline antics this weekend as he completes a ban for complaining about the refereeing during Palace's defeat against Tottenham."

  261. 1325: 
    Crystal Palace v Swansea (1330 BST)

    Meanwhile the Crystal Palace eagle has just flown a length of the pitch. Real-life mascots beat the ten-foot cuddly type hands down don't they?

  262. 1323: 
    Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    Germany manager Joachim Loew, with his suspiciously jet-black fringe flopping around his face, is in the stands at the Emirates to check on the form of Mesut Ozil. He is afforded a big hand-shake by Arsenal chief executive Ivan Gazidis.


    Martin Hill: Watching the derby from Sousse, Tunisia and even found some Utd and City fans to watch with in the bar! 1-0 United.

    Joseph Briefel: Stuck in the office in Cairo as the working week starts on a Sunday. Following the updates on #bbcfootball Come on you Gunners!!

  264. 1319: 
    Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    Arsenal boss Arsene Wenger on Nicklas Bendtner's return to the squad: "Bendtner has worked very hard and deserves a place on the bench today, Mikel Arteta is just a little bit short but it's good to have him back also.

    On Mesut Ozil's home debut: "There's a lot of expectation when you make a big signing like that, but hopefully he is used to that and I hope he doesn't put too much responsibility on his shoulders."

  265. 1319: 
    Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    When Marko Arnautovic arrived at previous club Werder Bremen from Inter Milan he wore boots emblazoned with 'Champions League winner 2010' despite not even making the bench for the final.

    Yep, I think he can deal with the attention.

    Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    Stoke manager Mark Hughes on recent signing Marko Arnautovic: "He's an exciting talent and we are all curious about how he deals with the Premier League, I've no doubt he will be a big talent for us and I think it was important to get him involved. There's a lot of pressure on him as it's a big occasion, but I think he will lap it up."

  267. 1316: 
    Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    Stoke manager Mark Hughes has just given his pre-match thoughts, saying he wants his side to come out and be positive against Arsenal. 'Positive' was rarely the adjective used for meetings between these sides when Tony Pulis was in charge of the Potters.

    Stoke's roughhouse tactics regularly unsettled Arsene Wenger. Perhaps understandably considering Aaron Ramsey's double leg fracture against them in 2010.

    MOTD commentator Steve Wilson on MOTD2 ExtraCrystal Palace v Swansea

    "I'm so full of admiration for Michael Laudrup. He seems to be extremely personable, intelligent, tactically astute. I thought Swansea were fantastic in Valencia.

    "I think if Swansea can have him for two years, they should look back on it as being two very good years."

  269. 1310: 
    Daily Telegraph football correspondent Henry Winter on MOTD2 ExtraCrystal Palace v Swansea (1330 BST)

    "I think Swansea will win the Europa League. I think if you look at their squad selections, their manager.

    "What a fantastic bit of man management (Laudrup showed) with Jonjo Shelvey against Liverpool. At half time he took him aside and told him to go and deliver in the second half. Then he provided the flick for Michu's equaliser."

    Former Everton and Sunderland winger Kevin Kilbane on MOTD2 ExtraChelsea 2-0 Sunderland

    "On current form, Romelu Lukaku is the best striker on Chelsea's books."

  271. 1308:  
    MOTD commentator Steve Wilson on MOTD2 ExtraCardiff v Tottenham

    "Jermain Defoe has made two starts and scored four goals this season. It's what he does. He's a finisher.

    "But it's a World Cup year. If he's not playing (for Spurs) and Roy Hodgson only takes four strikers, he won't be one of them."

  272. 1307: 

    Also struggling to get a look in is Jermain Defoe at Tottenham. The 30-year-old is yet to make a Premier League start. Might he get the nod for Cardiff at home after two goals against Tromso in midweek?

  273. 1305: 

    Matt Horsman: Di Canio is an honest and transparent footballing man, wearing his heart on his sleeve. I like him and hope he succeeds.

    Chris Donoghue: A friend of mine is getting married today. The couple are huge United supporters. Would hate for City to ruin their big day.

    Ben Cooke: Was starting to worry about Arsenal challenging the top 3 this year but then I saw Bendtner on their bench.

  274. 1304: 
    Daily Telegraph football correspondent Henry Winter on MOTD 2 ExtraChelsea 2-0 Fulham

    "I agree with Jose Mourinho about Oscar. He's their number 10. He scores, he tracks back, he puts tackles in. I understand that.

    "But what I don't understand is why Juan Mata has to be in the stands because he can fit into that system. One of their great successes last season is that those three (Oscar, Mata and Eden Hazard) interchanged. Chelsea would be a better team with Mata in it."

  275. 1304: 

    In a similar canny playmaker mould to Mesut Ozil, but feeling a lot less love, is Juan Mata. The Spaniard spent yesterday's win over Fulham in the stands after Jose Mourinho deemed him unworthy of even a place on the bench.

    Is that a way to treat the club's player of the year last season? In a World Cup year, he really won't be chuffed.

  276. 1300: 
    Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    Arsenal fans have been getting their Ozil on before the former Real Madrid man's home debut. By the sounds of it, the red half of north London has been going gaga for the German since deadline day.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    James ‏@HeelJames: A win today would send United top of the league, surely a huge boost for Moyes against his critics

    Rian Hoskins: The problem Sunderland have is their 14 new signings have barely any Premier League experience between them.

    Deepankar Kapila: Arsenal bench starting to take shape now. Options in every part of the field.

    What are your thoughts on today's hot topics? Get in touch using #bbcfootball.

  278. 1256: 
    Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)
    Arsenal programme

    Arsenal are marking 100 years since their relocation from south of the river Thames to Islington with a commemorative reissue of their first programme in their current home.

    "Good Afternoon Ladies and Gentleman...a Hearty Welcome" it begins. Lovely stuff, even Spurs fans will want a copy.

  279. 1253: 
    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball
    Paul Moore

    Paul Moore and family are off to the Manchester derby, are you on your way to a game? Send your photos of your journey or your arrival at whichever game you're attending to #bbcfootball

  280. 1253: 
    MOTD2 Extra has been discussing Sunderland manager Paolo Di CanioWest Brom 3-0 Sunderland

    Former Sunderland winger Kevin Kilbane: "There are obviously tensions with Paolo Di Canio now. The Sunderland fans, once they get their teeth into something, can be ferocious.

    "The team isn't playing particularly well but as long as the attention's on Di Canio the team's probably going to be in a better place for it."

    MOTD commentator Steve Wilson: "I have no idea what Di Canio is doing (by going over to the fans after yesterday's match). How can that benefit the dressing room? It's almost like Phil Brown doing his team talk on the pitch."

    The Daily Telegraph's Henry Winter: "The key man is (Sunderland owner) Ellis Short. He will see the headlines. He will see Di Canio going over to the supporters. He's made his money by making tough decisions through storms so I don't think he'll turn on Di Canio too quickly."

  281. 1250: 
    Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    Mikel Arteta has to be content with a place on the bench for Arsenal as he continues his comeback from injury.

    Arsene Wenger could do with a 3-7-0 formation to cram in all his midfield talent. Aaron Ramsey, Mesut Ozil, Santi Cazorla, Mikel Arteta, Jack Wilshere, Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain, Abou Diaby and Theo Walcott are all jostling for space in there.

    Considering the relative lack of competition in defence and attack, what do Arsenal fans make of the way Arsene Wenger has stocked his squad?

  282. 1246: 
    BREAKING TEAM NEWS- Crystal Palace v Swansea (1330 BST)

    Crystal Palace give a debut to Barry Bannan, while Adlene Guedioura and Cameron Jerome make their first starts after coming on against Manchester United.

  283. 1244: 
    LINE-UPS- Crystal Palace v Swansea (1330 BST)

    Crystal Palace: Speroni, Mariappa, Gabbidon, Delaney, Moxey, Jedinak, Guedioura, Bannan, Puncheon, Jerome, Chamakh

    Swansea: Vorm, Rangel, Chico, Williams, Davies, Canas, Shelvey, Dyer, Routledge, Michu, Vazquez

  284. 1243: 
    BREAKING TEAM NEWS- Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    Stoke bring in striker Marko Arnautovic for Matthew Etherington in the only change to their starting XI.

  285. 1243: 
    LINE-UPS- Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    Arsenal: Szczesny, Sagna, Mertesacker, Koscielny, Gibbs, Flamini, Ramsey, Wilshere, Ozil, Walcott, Giroud

    Stoke: Begovic; Cameron, Shawcross (c), Huth, Pieters; Walters, Wilson, Nzonzi, Adam, Arnautovic; Jones


    Tom, Newcastle, via mobile on 81111 (UK only): "Di Canio was the best thing since the ready-cut loaf after the 3-0 at St James in April. Shows how fleeting the honeymoon period is nowadays."

  287. 1241: 
    BREAKING TEAM NEWS- Arsenal v Stoke (1330 BST)

    German international Mesut Ozil will make his home debut as Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger keeps the same side that beat Marseille in midweek.

    GET INVOLVED #bbcfootball

    Vinod Raman: Di Canio... Take a bow... No manager has the guts to do what he did... Hope they start performing well

    The Doctor: Predictions for today: Arsenal 2 - 0 Stoke, Crystal Palace 1 - 3 Swans, Cardiff 1 - 1 Spurs, Man City 0 - 2 Man Utd

    Steven Brown: Can't really see anything but an Arsenal win today, just too strong going forward

  289. 1239: 
    BREAKING TEAM NEWS- Crystal Palace v Swansea (1330 BST)

    Swansea captain Ashley Williams is fit for the meeting with Crystal Palace while Jonjo Shelvey is back in the side.

  290. 1238:  
    Former Everton and Sunderland winger Kevin Kilbane on MOTD2 ExtraTHE MANCHESTER DERBY

    "You don't know what you're getting from Manchester City. Against Newcastle (earlier in the season) they were brilliant. I saw that and was thinking 'this is a real championship winning side'.

    "But now I can't ever say that Man City will turn up and produce a performance. That's why I don't think they'll win the league this season."

  291. 1234: 

    Both may have had heartening wins in Europe in midweek, against Bayer Leverkusen and Viktoria Plzen respectively, but there will probably be some premature under-the-breath grumbling if either David Moyes or Manuel Pellegrini suffer defeat today.

    Moyes already has a defeat against Liverpool on his record, while Pellegrini has collected only seven points from matches against Newcastle, Stoke, Cardiff and Hull.

  292. 1232: 
    MOTD2 Extra has been discussing how David Moyes has done as Manchester United managerTHE MANCHESTER DERBY

    MOTD commentator Steve Wilson: "I think David Moyes is starting to look like he's really enjoying the job. To me he doesn't look intimidated."

    The Daily Telegraph's Henry Winter: "He's handled the Wayne Rooney situation really well. If Sir Alex Ferguson had stayed I think Rooney would have gone to Chelsea.

    "But there was also this concern that Everton were cautious under Moyes. But then you saw against Leverkusen the other night - the great attacking, the good wing play. It was almost like a Ferguson performance."

  293. 1231: 
    Daily Telegraph football correspondent Henry Winter on MOTD2 Extra:THE MANCHESTER DERBY

    "Some people have been saying it's the game that will define the season. It's far too early to say that. But I think it will define the reputations of the new managers in the eyes of their fans.

    "A result for David Moyes will cement him in the hearts of the United fans. Man City fans have taken to Manuel Pellegrini but he'll need a good result today too."

  294. 1230:  
    MOTD commentator Steve Wilson on MOTD2 ExtraTHE MANCHESTER DERBY

    "It's always a big occasion but it's far too early to say either side can't afford to lose. However the mood will change according to what happens today."

  295. 1230:  
    BBC Radio 5 live

    FA vice-chairman and former Manchester United chief executive David Gill speaking about Wayne Rooney on BBC Radio 5 live's Sportsweek: "We're not in the business of strengthening our key competitors in England, and I think that would've been very difficult, but we wanted to keep him in any event, not sell him oversees either.

    "You don't win football matches with money in the bank, you win it with great players on the pitch. And Wayne Rooney has been and I think will continue to be, a great player for Manchester United."

  296. 1225: 
    Wayne Rooney

    One man who revels in the white heat of a Manchester derby is Wayne Rooney. The Manchester United striker is just one goal away from surpassing the record of 10 in the fixture that he currently shares with City legends Franny Lee and Joe Hayes.

    Earlier this year, when transfer speculation was swirling round him, he seemed more likely to be scoring in yesterday's west London derby for Chelsea...

  297. 1220: 
    Paulo Di Canio

    Former Sunderland manager Peter Reid has been speaking to BBC 5 live's Sportsweek programme about the problems facing current incumbent Paulo Di Canio, whose side are bottom of the Premier League with just one point from five games.

    Di Canio has been critical of his players in public, but Reid told Garry Richardson that's not the best approach:

    "The bottom line is that he needs results, but any manager needs his players as well. You can always volley players, in any walk of life people need a kick up the backside every now and then, but you cannot keep on doing it.

    "Sometimes it's best to do it in private. It's a manager's prerogative to get into players every now and then, but you cannot do it all the time.

    "The fans are going to be a big influence on the next couple of games. The manager and the players need to be as one as well."

  298. 1218: 

    Despite a humdinger of a come-from-behind win for Hull at Newcastle and the wheels wobbling on Liverpool's wagon, the most extraordinary story yesterday was manager Paolo di Canio having a 40-yard post match stare-off with his Sunderland fans after their 3-0 defeat to West Brom.

    The video, if you haven't seen it yet, is on the BBC website for your enjoyment/bafflement.

    Are those the actions of dead man walking? Or can he turn round the Black Cats tanker?

    Answers on a tweet or a text.

  299. 1215: 

    There's a lot at stake in today's Premier League fixtures - the top of the table, bragging rights, and more - and we want to hear from you as the afternoon unfolds.

    The two Manchester clubs or north London rivals Tottenham and Arsenal could replace Chelsea at the top of the league tonight, and United and City have the small matter of a derby at the Etihad Stadium.

    Stoke and Cardiff will be keen to spring a surprise on Arsenal and Spurs respectively, while Crystal Palace are striving to get out of the bottom three at home to Swansea.

    Tweet us at #bbcfootball or text in on 81111 (UK only, and don't forget to tell us who you are). Also check out our Facebook page for the latest action pictures.

    Going to a game? We want photos of your journey to, and arrival at, the ground. Tweet your pics using #bbcfootball

  300. 1213: 

    This live text commentary has just been bolstered by some shiny live video to help speed us towards kick-off.

    MOTD 2 Extra, on BBC One and online right now, will be pulling the entrails out of the weekend's talking points.

    Coming up swift on the heels of that will be live commentary on Crystal Palace v Swansea on BBC Radio 5 live sports extra, followed by Manchester City v Manchester United on BBC Radio 5 live.

    And then the best of the today's action will be all over your regular full-fat Match of the Day 2 which is on BBC One and online from 2220 BST tonight.

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Premier League results

22 Sep 2013 23:59 UK

Premier League table snapshot

As it stood on 22 Sep 2013 23:59 UK

Position Team P GD PTS
1 Arsenal 5 5 12
2 Tottenham 5 4 12
3 Man City 5 8 10
4 Chelsea 5 4 10
5 Liverpool 5 2 10
6 Everton 5 2 9
7 Southampton 5 1 8
8 Man Utd 5 1 7
9 Swansea 5 0 7
10 Stoke 5 -1 7
11 Hull City 5 -2 7
12 Newcastle 5 -3 7
13 Aston Villa 5 0 6
14 West Brom 5 0 5
15 West Ham 5 0 5
16 Cardiff 5 -2 5
17 Norwich 5 -3 4
18 Fulham 5 -4 4
19 Crystal Palace 5 -4 3
20 Sunderland 5 -8 1

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